In this episode the hosts are joined by J. Baker and discusses if they would give a pro audio company second chance after a bad experience. The hosts receive their first question to answer on the podcast. Oshay brings up the topic of tipping your engineer. Chaos and Czar discuss how they use multi band compression.
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- AudioCzar901
- IamKadencePAT
- _Chaosa
- ItspronouncedOshay
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Join our Facebook group Faders Up Podcast.
Have a question you want answered on the podcast? Email us at FadersUpPodcast@yahoo.com
In this episode the hosts are joined by J. Baker and discusses if they would give a pro audio company second chance after a bad experience. The hosts receive their first question to answer on the podcast. Oshay brings up the topic of tipping your engineer. Chaos and Czar discuss how they use multi band compression.
Follow the hosts and podcast on Instagram
- FadersUpPodcast
- AudioCzar901
- IamKadencePAT
- _Chaosa
- ItspronouncedOshay
- IamJBaker
Join our Facebook group Faders Up Podcast.
Have a question you want answered on the podcast? Email us at FadersUpPodcast@yahoo.com
spk_0: 0:00
This is the feeders of podcast.
spk_2: 0:05
Uh uh, Katie way. Welcome to the favors of podcast. Times are bad. A
spk_3: 0:25
young chaos. I'm Jay Bakker. I was trying to keep it like I thought we were gonna do. Maybe, like, a build up like Sampat. Well, getting
spk_0: 0:41
here for a little bit. So I hear.
spk_3: 0:44
But it was well done. Come on. I thought it was Well
spk_0: 0:48
sorry. Hey. Trying to put a little extra energy and he
spk_3: 0:51
just right. And I was trying to feed off of you.
spk_4: 0:54
Yeah, It's been, like six episodes where we're so bad at this. So we got our first question. We're not starting, Andrew. I didn't even introduce myself, so I thought
spk_3: 1:04
you did. Okay. Way. Well, let's start over, okay? Reduce myself. Just make sure the practice these when we go home tonight.
spk_4: 1:14
Uh, okay. Welcome to the favors of podcasts. I'm Czar. I'm
spk_3: 1:19
Pat Am. Chaos was going on.
spk_1: 1:21
Yeah, you boyo. Shane, You know what it is
spk_4: 1:25
and we've got Jay Bakker got J bigger here, would us again. We have our first question and this goes around D s. Er's. This question is from Cameron Hammel and he wants to know where does a D s or go in the chain, which is a really good the question. So for those of us here that are engineers, we've already singled out a couple people who you can, and it's not gonna have any input on this. But I never thought about this. I thought that this is a really good question. So, uh, you might want to take any harm to go ahead.
spk_3: 2:05
I think just kind of thinking about it, because from one I honestly don't use d. Esther's that much. I'm kinda like how you said, Czar,
spk_4: 2:13
What beautifully perfect vocals Have you been recording?
spk_3: 2:15
I mean, I just kind of pulled him like that, but, um, or get or get to mix? Yeah, I don't know. I just have a heart. I could love vocals. And so I don't like mess with folks who don't have good cause. I'm sorry I'm just booty like that, but I honestly don't have to use the d s of that much, I think, cause I think I get a good recording at first. Especially if I'm hearing those s has come through while we're recording. I'll do how we suggested last episode. Tilt the mike, move it off his access. I'll tell the artist to step back so I you know, I usually don't have to use it off rip. And when I do have to use it, I'll use it after I realized I needed because to me, because I feel like a D ester is very necessary. But sometimes you can't overuse it to where now you're s is or your Sullivan's in the vocal or whatever has no presence. So I'll use it after I'm like, OK, after I've compressed after I've e cute because that'll take out a lot of the nasty frequencies anyway. Then I'll be like, down this ship needs a d. S because I'm here in nothing but as is and I put it on this channel, I won't put it on a bus or another channel. Put it on that.
spk_4: 3:25
It's definitely too much D s ing will make will make the vocal dark. In a lot of times I can't stand the dark vocal, but I gotta go get my answer. So for me, the first thing I do to a vocal first plug in I put on it isn't he cute And I'm doing like you just mentioned, uh, corrective e queuing, removing any frequencies I don't want if I have to. Or if you remove low mids or even too much low mids is going to make the vocal even brighter because you're taking away some of that lower end energy. Then the vocals get brighter and then this is jump out even more because now the vocals brighter. So for me a d s there is the second thing that I put on If I need to after correct of a queuing So the first thing I'd do is remove any frequencies I don't want. Then I d s. And then from there I'm probably compressing. And then after that, I used additive E Q to boost any frequencies. Ah, do one
spk_3: 4:28
ad. You don't feel like compressing cause the DSR just basically compresses, right? Yes, compressing That's what scientific frequent frequency. Yeah. Do you ever boost the gain? Is that even the option? I'm trying to think
spk_4: 4:43
on a di essere. Yeah, because you don't use them. I don't promise. Um
spk_1: 4:50
I don't know because he's still a dynamics based processors,
spk_4: 4:55
but she's asking to boost the game doesn't have a game
spk_1: 4:58
tonight, and that's what I'm saying. I mean, it depends because we all know different plug in. We could have five different compressor plug in, and it won't all have the same controls. But off the top of my head, I'm thinking it should just because it is a dynamics based processor which ultimately effects volume.
spk_4: 5:17
And I guess you'd be the wrong person to ask about this. O'Shea, since you just use the default setting on the fact
spk_3: 5:21
that one there, where was
spk_1: 5:25
going with that way? So, yeah, I love the fact filter di essere And so far it just worked out for me that when I'm playing on or when I insert it, it's already good, like I've tweaked it a little bit. But then it's like and let's find a way it was before. So just command click on the button and send it back to D for
spk_4: 5:47
the game. I can't think of one that has an actual game where you can increase the gain, but they all for what I can think about top my head right now, have it a gain that's already had zeroed. You can pull it down from there, Okay? I do believe because I use my go to right now is the wave siblings okay? Which they gave away for free, I think last black Friday, maybe year before that. But, uh, that's been my go to the waves are DSR I like that a lot. And I got the MC d s p d. Yes, sir. I use those Other three are pretty much alternate with. I've been using civilians the most because it requires the least work for me to get it up and going. And I don't have it anymore, because when they went to 64 bit when they were from 32 bit to 64 bit, I never upgraded. But so, Knox, I cannot go look it up now the so Knox, they've got a d s, sir. That's really really killer. And I cannot think of the name of it just because I haven't used it in in so long. All right, I got it. I remember it. It's the so Knox suppressor. That is a D s r from so Knox. Uh, and, uh, it's really good. I said I just when they went up to 64 bit. I just never upgraded. But I'm thinking about upgrading you getting involved a bag because so Knox makes really great stuff.
spk_3: 7:12
And I think a part of my question two was that, like, if you put a DSR on before you put a compressor, do you feel like how do you make sure you don't over compress the syllabus? You know what I mean of the vote off? Well, I just use vocal cause
spk_4: 7:28
yet be so think of it like this. So the DSR is already compressing discipline. So the DSR is already bringing the civilians down. So then compressing after that is going to compress the overall vocal full range everything. Unless you've got your high pass and low pass set on the compressor. But we'll just the first and a compressor gate. You're compressing the whole range of the vocal at that point after the esses are already been knocked down by the D s, sir. So
spk_3: 7:58
when they come up, they come up evenly and they won't stick out that the esses won't stick out after you when you
spk_4: 8:05
right, they should be. If you've said the DSR correctly, they should already sound even after just d s. And
spk_1: 8:11
that's what I was about to say to make sure you don't like over basically compress on the D s, sir. Because all of them, yes, sir, is they give you, like, basically a game reduction meter just like a compressor. And so I just do it to where he just gets it. Because I still want kind of that, that clarity in the vocal I don't want it to sound muddy, and I just wanted to get it so it doesn't sound so like a snake hissing.
spk_4: 8:40
I'm down to maybe anywhere between six and 12 d. B. Sometimes even doing s is. But if you go too far is going to start sound dark and you'll really start to hear that tone changes because you're killing the high end in that vocal. See, it's gonna get dark. So that's when you here it started to get dark. That's when you kind of back off back off of it. And you and, uh, this mix I just finished. I had I had a DSR had the wave semblance and it took care of 99% of the vocal. But there was one s that was still just jumping out. And so, um, just like you can in pro tools. Ah, audio suite, where you can affect just that region. You couldn't do that in studio One, so I just took, like, just that s And I think I put the r d s, sir on Just that s and knocked it down is well, and it took care of it. Mmm.
spk_3: 9:36
Do you know, I hope that answers your question. Listen, we appreciate you for listening to favours up our CASS.
spk_4: 9:42
Absolutely. So this ever. So we're going to get into Would we give a company a second chance? Because on the NAM episode here, Noah Chaos said that she didn't fool with, um the priest on his fate report after an issue she had with it. J. Baker, you mentioned the pre Sonus? Um, there's a FireWire interface and said you wouldn't fool with them anymore. And so I got to thinking about what we give companies second chances after we had,
spk_0: 10:16
huh? I said they just done with pre son is all
spk_4: 10:19
right now, And to be fair, and I don't know if you remember this, but I believe it was you, Pat, that I helped with a pre Sonus firewire interface at one time that we had some problems getting the going. So I know that that sounds like three strikes against Arizona's, but I'm gonna defend them in 2020 because yeah, that I remember that interface. We did have some of that might've been on Windows computer to
spk_0: 10:44
Mmm mmm. Mmm. Yeah. We were somewhere as we wanted the house.
spk_4: 10:48
Okay, but I I want to defend Chris honest on that, because with their they've got ah, hub now, or software universal control that all of their interfaces and products connect to and everything they come in come up with now is just stupid. Simple tow hook up and get going. You plug, you run your driver's plug it up. It shows up in the shows up in the software until you figured a firmware update. No, blah, blah, blah. But yeah, I want to get into you know what we give company second chance of this. So
spk_3: 11:22
for me, it just appearance, I guess on what I'm buying the company itself and what I'm buying and how how? I guess bad I needed or why I'm using it, you know, I mean, I typically give companies a second chance, you know? I mean, nobody's perfect. Nothing is perfect. You know, saying anything man made it will break. You know, I'm saying so. It's not gonna be perfect. So I give you benefit of the doubt, and that was that respect. But at the same time, I'm just because of the service. Gotta be on point. You can't give me the runaround if I do need your
spk_0: 11:53
help. So So, yeah, there. That's very house from eggs. Are we giving second chances on customer service of second chance on the product? Because that's what everything.
spk_3: 12:03
What? I like
spk_1: 12:04
the way he kept it vague because that gives us two room that answer like hever cut. For me, it depends like so not only did it doesn't depend on the category like whether it's customer service, whether it's functionality, but it also depends on how much am I depending on this particular credit, right? If it's somewhere is like, it's my bread and butter. Sometimes you just got put up with certain stuff is like, Hey, I really need this. I would love to leave the company but
spk_3: 12:36
I mean
spk_0: 12:37
me personally. I wouldn't give second chances on product. Many like function now. Yeah, with some product now not getting a second chance out of me. And I get my money that somebody give it to me for Frieda's on this
spk_3: 12:54
second chance, meaning that you can take the 1st 1 back like I don't have to spend my money again. You like so much. Talk
spk_0: 13:01
about second chance. I bought it. This time I had a bad experience. Well, I go back and buy gear
spk_4: 13:06
or by something else from that company. And so
spk_0: 13:09
I'm saying he is. If I get a product and I have a bad experience, it was bad, you know, Gear, whatever. I'm not going back to them to buy more. Now. Bad customer service. I will get him a second chance because I know everybody you talked to is different. Help The chance of you talking that same person, Berry Slim at times depending on
spk_4: 13:31
the company, depending on the company, because somebody's companies are small. Where's 34 people? You know, the husband builds the gear and the wife does the books, and that's the company.
spk_3: 13:41
I've had experiences where It's been a random customer service person every time you and that's really frustrating. And then I've had situations where is like, Okay, call me back. Specifically. Here's my ex nation. Here's my email, you know? And that's favorable. But when it comes to when he comes to like a product, I may have just gotten a bad piece of equipment. So I'm going to return the equipment to you. Well, you know, I'm saying to get another piece of equipment. If that piece of equipment doesn't work, then it's like, Okay, well, this piece of equipment doesn't work, and I probably like Pat won't buy again from that
spk_4: 14:16
company. Yeah, I'm not I'm not mad it stuff that breaks could stuff. It happened. I understand that. Well, how we handle that? Yeah, it is. Yes.
spk_0: 14:26
Well, I think I'm also talking about, like, functionality, like I know stuff breaks in ship in the It might be a bad keyboard are Michael,
spk_1: 14:36
Would you gentlemen like they make a bad product? Like like it
spk_0: 14:40
did sound? My things go do this. You don't
spk_4: 14:42
like the NPC element? Yeah, pretty much. Where I thought it was gonna load my well. Like I
spk_0: 14:48
said in the episode about the machine, like I had a bad time learning how to do it. So it's gonna be hard for me to go get a machine again. Now, I've heard the same thing that you told me like, Oh, that's why you need to use the studio. I heard that multiple times. But it's gonna take a lot for Meteo
spk_1: 15:07
you. All right, hand that experience that Exactly. Right. Make concrete
spk_3: 15:13
right? I'm not really had a bad experience. My bad experience comes from people buying gear from third party people like my worst experience was River. I'm sorry. My worst experience was this place. Online way
spk_4: 15:41
put it after that. Was that riverbed? Was that the seller himself? Coming about one piece of gear on reverb. And it was I had No, What is Weaver? Reverb is like eBay for studio gears
spk_3: 15:51
during studio is good, I think is good because, like, eBay, it really depends on the person you're dealing with you. So this situation I sold my warm audio 11 76. You sold it on reverb, okay? And it was just a shitty, shitty terrible times. Does
spk_4: 16:10
reverb take fees? Are they do? They take any of
spk_3: 16:13
you, take coffee, take a seller's fee. Um, in this was so annoying because I didn't know there's going in, but the duel was in Canada. Had to deal with shit being across state lines. I mean, cross, um Borders, which wasn't the hard part. I looked it up. Research to make sure I didn't write the part. That was frustrating was that the package got lost. Yes. A river doesn't pay out when you're a seller. They won't pay you on your first sale right away, like the money has been paid by the customer. But they won't give you the money until the item gets to the customer. Which makes sense. But I didn't know that at the time, so I was frustrated. Why the fuck am I got my money? Well, the president had gotten their package. It took him a month and 1/2 to get their package it came down to. I think it got lost. And then also, by time, they found it and got it on the truck. It was Christmas time. So do had gotten out of town and didn't really get it till like mid January, So I didn't get my money till mid January. So that was just like, ah, whole situation that because of their piracy, because this fart face fuck face, who didn't understand who doesn't understand how match pairs work? Because he was, after all, that he wanted a fucking refund. He wanted to give it back because he realized he had another warm audio and he was like, Oh, I thought it'd be a matched pair were selling one. I was like, Brother and my message. I said that I'm like, matched pairs were sold together. Fool. He's like the needles aren't moving at the same time. I'm like you, stupid. And I hated him so much because of the situation by this point. But that's why I just wanted to see the needles move. He didn't even he probably wasn't using it for what you're supposed to use it for. Connectedness, even needles move and talking about a match payrolls buying one old warm audio to match an older warm audio and try and get a matched pair. So that was my main gripe. Is the people
spk_4: 18:14
with it being your first sale to you want your your feedback and raiding to be good, Good.
spk_3: 18:20
You know, it was terrible. And then the other time I on reverb and I just wanted to stop fucking with River. Gave him a second chance. I gave him a second chance. Selling now buying. There's no problem. Like you said, Like I
spk_4: 18:35
had no issues by like, dude with super Super cool would be even hail to the day I bought it. And I told him, You know, I'm about to go out of town. Can you wait until, like, Thursday to ship this? And he was like, you know, no, no problems. It worked. I got my package the day I came back in town. Perfect.
spk_3: 18:50
Right? And it can be that way and actually do something. But I sold my SP 44 on their easy do was in Nashville. We met Operate, You know, it was easy, so I thought maybe shipping wouldn't be so bad. But the second time I was selling an old akai Ah x r 20. I think Africa is one of the earlier drum pads that I'm drum machines that they have. And I sold it to a dude, shipped it to him. It went through smooth. And then he was Oh, um, I think I put on the description. You needed batteries, and he's like, No, I should be able just to plug it up. I shouldn't need batteries like No, this one. These batteries. You okay? I want my money back. I was like, Fine dude shipped it back and it got lost in the mail. This man shipped it back by putting it in a blue mailbox. He didn't go to the post office to give
spk_1: 19:37
me the one that you just
spk_3: 19:38
over Dryland like a fart face. And I didn't He just had it. It was just so on. Double River. Just people reverb people by way of reverb. I'll still buy on river, but I won't.
spk_1: 19:55
Or river. Oh, that. Yeah, that probably sounds worse than the experience I had with cash up. Whose name? I don't mind mentioning. And, ah, particular pro audio retailer. Um,
spk_0: 20:11
they use cash out.
spk_1: 20:12
No, no. All right. So let me explain this situation. So So my cousin, my cousin wanted a machine like my cousin back in Maryland. You want to start again? Making beats? I'm like a man. I get discounts You know, I'm saying, like, a different pro audio places, man. Like, I'll get it for you. Save your few bucks. So my cousin cash at me, like $238 right? I got to quote from two different companies. I decided to go with you. No company. A So I called him place. You know, I got to quote placed auto over the phone. Boom. Everything goes through, I look in my cash at Boom. The money has been deducted. All right, cool. A few hours later, I'm looking like like it looks like basically, they tried to run the payment multiple times. So my cash efforts looking funny, I call the retailer. They don't have a record of it like Oh, yeah. The payment didn't go through. Yeah.
spk_4: 21:08
You spoke to the Philippines? Stop. I don't
spk_0: 21:11
know. So you paid the company week cans
spk_3: 21:15
out? Yeah, I
spk_1: 21:16
have the cash up card. Oh, thank you for asking that for clear. So for those yachts don't know, cash app has an actual visa credit debit card. Okay. I had that car, so I paid with that car. It's obviously connected to the cash out, right, and
spk_0: 21:36
they tried to run it multiple times.
spk_1: 21:38
Yeah. And so essentially, what happened was it was like, I think, like, two weeks or so off going back and forth. They did know they did it. No, they did it. We don't have it. We don't have it. Accident, Accident, Accident. And I would I would like, so irritated because it was, like with cash at the problem was every person I corresponded with it was a different person every time. So get back to what I was saying earlier about chances are you and I didn't even go get the same person. Imagine 10 e mails with 10 different people in every time they're starting with. Oh, sorry. Your issue wasn't resolved, but I'm so I'm so I'm gonna do this today and your restating the issue. So I'm dealing with them. I'm also dealing with the read. So was oh, cash up. Like the money regular of the money the money would like in the black hole. The money wasn't in my cash app account. The ah crap This
spk_0: 22:41
Go See you in there.
spk_1: 22:43
No, edit that out because I still have a relationship with them. Um but yes, O the retailer didn't have it. And I didn't have my product. So it was like, I don't have the money. They don't have the money. I don't have the product or the money. So it's kind of like, Where the hell is the money?
spk_0: 23:02
Well, where since? So they swiped the multiple times, but it wasn't showing up on
spk_1: 23:08
that exact. Now you see my friend. Now imagine filling how you feel right now. The confusion. But imagine it going on your cash. Exactly. Exactly. Imagine that. Imagine that confusion and frustration going on for two weeks, right? Yes.
spk_3: 23:25
Awesome. Papa. Pope. I
spk_1: 23:26
mean, so I'm talking about like I win because I'm like, I don't personally know the people that cash out, But I know I can pull up on this retailer right now face to face, like, because I've had a long leg shit with them and nothing like this ever happened. So I pull up and wreck, Man, I'm so sorry, man. I don't know what's going on, like we don't have it. Look, see blah, blah, But I'm like, I feel what you saying, but they're telling me the same thing and all I want is my money back or the machine that I paid for, right? So eventually I forget how it gets worked out. But eventually, somehow, and neither side ever admit it too. It was their fault. But eventually, somehow the money gets back on my cash up. I said after I am dealing with them no more ripped up my cash at car. I ain't dealing with them no more. And in back of my mind, I would like unless that quote is a lot cheaper than the other company that I ended up buying it through doing that second chance. Yeah, if the if. The quotas right now. And I'm and I'm not. Yeah, that's what I said. I still got a relationship with them, so but yes. Oh, my issue was Customer service is like I just need somebody to take ownership, other situation and fix it.
spk_4: 24:48
So is this brings me to a question here? So, what's more important to you? That company reputation or the price?
spk_1: 24:58
Good question. Ah, it depends.
spk_3: 25:01
Like move combination above. Yeah, it's a mixture because
spk_1: 25:05
it isn't how much you're saving, man, like you're talking 5 $10.
spk_4: 25:09
So? So? So let me tell You also said this. This Why ask that question? Because So I bought last year. I bought a patch Bay E I bought by, uh, awesome cables about. So about the patch bay from Sweetwater. It was, Ah, a demo unit. So it was chambers and them. I had to hate to jump on that open box. It was already cheaper. Give me that. I get that. I need some patch cables. Patch bay cables on. Sweetwater was like, $80 I think.
spk_1: 25:42
Which is D B to five
spk_4: 25:44
of the TT. So then go to musicians. Friends who? I think I hit, like, a 20% coupon code. So I get the cables for, like, 50 something. Okay, I get the cables. That was about that. About those cables, I think. Like last April. Okay. Just like September last year. Now one of the cables stop working. Okay, I I hit up Musicians, friends. I'm like, yo, cables not working. Do go tell me in the chat. He said Okay. First thing he says is I see you didn't buy the warranty, would it? And I'm like, I didn't go. I did not. No, I did not. Okay, tables. So he tells me, Well, there's no problem. We can get you some more. I said, Give me some or how you want me to pay for him And he was like, Yeah, I said, No, I'm not. No. So finally, I told him I said, Look, I know I have a one year warranty with E. I have one year manufacturer's warranty on top. So you know. So he finally at that point gave me the number to the company. I had to call them and get a new cable from them. But the whole time I'm going through this, I'm thinking to myself, head I bought from Sweetwater, I would not have had that problem,
spk_3: 27:13
right? It's our centre trying to play me like that, and I wasn't going. See what happened was I have about a minute whom I had a midi keyboard, right? Jumping any weapon would they was like, um, they tried to pass my situation off to meet contacting the manufacturer, but I was like I bought this from y'all like you not for niches in the past, His book off like, you know what I mean. And
spk_0: 27:38
I was like anyone especially if it's within a year. Exactly. Yeah. Come on. But yeah, blame everything on the menu. Fact that you get so you selling my stuff So you you just
spk_4: 27:50
is responsible. But I'm thinking to myself, you know, if I would spend his extra $20 got this for sweet water you want as their problems, we want to be like, Oh, man, I'm so sorry. And cables not working. Let me get you a new one, baby right now or they would have probably contact. I had my court writing my court try. And extreme I had I had loaded the original court trying sounds on it and was playing with it. I tried to go back to the tried and extreme sounds, and I couldn't figure out how to get to try and extreme sounds back on there. I had a session in, like, 30 minutes, so I'm freaking out now. I'm like, I can't get these beats back up. I called. I don't know what to do. I call sweet water because that's all about the keyboard from Sweetwater. Puts Cork on three way with me their support and do walks me through how to load the factory. Sounds back in
spk_0: 28:43
Sweetwater Just got some brandy
spk_1: 28:47
without hesitation. So I've been dealing with sweet water for at least seven years. Without question, nobody's even close to the customer service like they are amazing.
spk_4: 29:00
So And to go hear this back to giving a company second chance. So this'll is a company would not give a second chance to see what you all think of of this story here. So I had in Orion 32 antelope in Ryan 32. I paid 3000 for it because I had at the time I hit three interfaces. I told myself this one interface has more io than the three of my interfaces that I'm taking up space to get. Well, yes. When this was two years ago. Now. Okay, so and at the time, So in the Orion, 32 went down in, like, 2200 because they came out the A Ryan 32 studio in the Ryan thirties. All these other products. So it made mine my original one go from 3000 down to, like, 2200 because those newer ones were priced up there now. Okay, So I have I have an issue with it. It, um what was going on? Oh, I was getting static in all of my inputs and outputs, even with nothing plucked into the back of it. Just on even the, uh, meters all jumping up. Go home. Okay, okay. No sums. Wrong. All right. Contact Antelope and they try to fix it over the phone. And I'm like, you could do what you got. You do what you want to do, but just going. Just gonna have to go back, You know? I'm just gonna have to go back. I didn't do it. No, I send it back to antelope. Ah. Which Watson to? To there. Um, I send it to their people that their repair shop in the U. S. I think was in California. They hit me back, and they tell me that it's ah, power supply. No. First they said it was the circuit board. They said my circuit board was fried, and it costs $1000 to fix it. So I said, Absolutely not. This is I bought this for $3000. Now you want me to pay 1000 to fix it? And some Bush and the and a brand new one right now. Cost 2200. So you want me to pay almost half of a new one to fix this? Oh, man. So then, like a week later, they emailed me back and says, Actually, we found out the issue. It was a power supply issue is gonna cost 500. And I'm like, so you just misdiagnosed my shit
spk_3: 31:26
down. Really is like, how you gonna miss diagnose your own, You know,
spk_4: 31:32
so hot about that. So at this point, I've now. And at the time I knew someone who worked for and Lope, I hit them up. I'd also hit up my sweet water sales person at the same time. Because at this point, I'm kind of looking for a replacement. Did might not make it back to the studio. So But at the time, there was nothing that does 32 in and albums all in one box, but, uh, telling my sweet water rap about it. And he's, um he's telling me he knows he knows people in love. Let me let me see what is going on. Um and kind of hint said that this isn't the first like issue that's going on with it, so we'll see what they will do. So but this is around the time. Also. I go up to Sweetwater for gear fasts, as I go to every year, and my sales rep introduces me to the VP of marketing for antelope. And I'm kind of telling her the problem. I'm like, Look, I don't mind paying to get it fixed. That's not a problem. I'm not paying this amount to get it fixed. That that's that's what the issue is. And she starts today. We've had issues with that. Come on, that company. I'm like what you are going do about it, right? You know, at this point, my, my sweet water, it is trying to get me a brand new unit. And I'm telling him like I'm telling him, I appreciate what you're doing, but really, this is out of your hands in a way, you sweet water. His two year warranty has been over two years. You know, we're outside of your warranty. Whatever. I mean, if you could give me a new unit. Great. But this really this is between me and Angelo. So then I meet eso. Then we discuss summer Nam is like two weeks after gear. Fists. Antelope tells me they're gonna be at summer name to that I'm in Nashville. So, you know, we talked about me Bring in my unit two summer name now so they can take it back to Ah. Well, where's the antelope? It? I almost said Bangladesh is not book area there in bulk area. OK, but they said they could fix it for cheaper there, but the issue is steal. This company in California still hasn't unit. I have. I got to pay them to get it back. So I'm just I'm hot about all of that. All of you know, the way this is going down. So because I just feel like any other company I would've dealt with would have took care of this or would have had a flat repair rate, which most companies have just a flat, you know, 10% of the cost unit. Whatever. Okay, so So at this point, I go ahead and, uh, pay the 500 or whatever to get it back. Because I ended up having a conversation with someone. I'll say the names with someone. I know it pre Sonus and they told me they were coming out with an interface that, uh does 32 by 32 all in one box. And it was 1500 I was like, Oh, oh, I'm a have my money ready. So I paid the 500 toe fix it, got it back, sold it to another retailer and took that money and got, uh, got the pre Sonus Quantum 48 48. But yeah, At that point, I was done with antelope and I really set back and thought about it. Also, I've invested Maur if you look at my studio at that time, Antelope Gear was the most gear that I've invested into it because that and a little Ryan 32 was 3000. I've got the antelope here, too. That was 2000. I've got $5000 of antelope gears in here, and at this point, like I'm I will eventually want something comes along that I'm really to swap out for. That pier, too, was gone. I don't want anything in alone in my studio anymore. We've got antelope interface in this studio, and I'm trying to get rid of it, so things just like me. Oh, yeah, I just I couldn't believe the way uh, I just I couldn't believe the way that went down.
spk_3: 35:50
I feel that field because it's like you said, It's a lot of time money spent into it. So, like when they can't deliver is just like Okay, you you gave them time to, like, fix it Like meant them up. Met up with them several times. So I'll be staying by
spk_4: 36:08
your product, right? Right. Stand by your product. Oh, let me throw this into the story, too. Wild Homage. More while I met Gear fast, I didn't say anything because I knew what was going on while I met Gear Face and y'all may have got this email to. There's a email that gets sent to all Sweetwater customers, effective immediately. We are no longer selling antelope audio gear, so people were kind of wondering where that came from, and I kind of knew yes, because of issues that there and think Sweetwater is, if I'm not mistaken, the third largest retailer, third largest pro audio retailer in the country, So to not be sold by the like people, some companies dreams start to get into sweet water and have them sell your product. And I know I know distributors that have spent 2 to 3 years now getting products that they distribute out into, ah, in the sweet water. So to have them pull the plug on you like that, that's gotta suck.
spk_3: 37:16
It says a lot that says a whole lot.
spk_4: 37:19
I just speaking of buying gear, where were some places that everyone buys gear from
spk_3: 37:25
eBay, eBay all day, all day, Eve? A. Every day, I promise is coming. But after a while I was like like these last few bits of gear I got. I got it straight from a guy like I have a gear guy. Now that so I feel much more secure gear. Got a gear guy g like, literally. His house is full of gear. He has nothing but gear in his house. He has no furniture. He has gear. He has nothing. So that's what he does. So he buys gear, fixes it. Ah, does what he does and just resells it. He, um yeah, he's pretty. I don't know if he fixes it. I'm sure he does, but he's pretty much a supplier. He rents gear he's worked for, you know, a lot of different companies. And so from there, he has a deal. You can just kind of get, um you know, the new four affordable price that he helped me re up my whole studio for under $10,000. And as I got the microphone, I got the stressor. I got gear cases
spk_4: 38:27
because you got the connect. Yeah, I'm gonna need a flute. Assumes we wrap up soon.
spk_1: 38:34
You said this is a bit of a cellar.
spk_3: 38:37
No, this is my gear guy. But before my gear guy, I went through eBay, and I was I
spk_1: 38:43
I'm sorry. It's, like, independent gear guy, or did you work for? Oh,
spk_3: 38:48
he's independent. And his house, Um, it's just really full of gear because he's just accumulated so much. So he really is looking toe all right of you, But yeah, it has been a blessing. That's where I get my gear from now.
spk_4: 39:01
So you kind of brought up. What? Where else? I wanted to go. But I'll finish with this topic first. Where you where you bought from?
spk_1: 39:09
Um, mainly other Sweetwater or Guitar Center. I had different reasons for each one s so what I do, I get quotes from each company on. And that's just a practice from when I was working in education, anything over $100 you had to get a quote. And so I still do that. I still have those relationships and usually depending what it is. I mean, I'll go for, you know, the least expensive option, but kind of going back to your examples like sometime. Cheaper isn't better, right? If you have to do a certain stuff. So if it is only a difference of a few bucks, To be honest, I would probably go with sweet water. And the reason why I won excellent customer service. Like my guy Jeffrey Green over its sweet. What? I don't I don't know if that's your guy, too, but, um, man, great main, you know, gets me good deals. But on top of that, I love because they have a sweet water card. So I don't have to pay cash up front. Just put on my card and get qualified for one or 24 48 months. No interest deals
spk_4: 40:16
you and you're going somewhere else. I want to go. Let me, uh I do sweet water a lot. I do. Uh, it does if you notice, but, uh, I guess it happened Maybe last year. Sweetwater, start charging sales tax now. Really?
spk_1: 40:33
I don't know. I just got a phone for them.
spk_3: 40:36
See when you don't. Actually, I used
spk_4: 40:39
to always announce one of my things. Sweetwater is like, I don't have to, You know, you don't have to pay sales tax, but now they're charging sales sex. Now it's funny. They
spk_1: 40:46
do free shipping
spk_4: 40:47
using a free shipping vintage king aboard a few things for vintage King. But I ordered a, uh, open box Kush Electra E Q. And I got to the check out and I saw the sales tax. I'm so used to not paying sales tax. I saw the sales tax pop up. I said, what sales tax? I gotta rethink this now, but I went ahead and let me do this because there's a vintage king over and Berryhill in Nashville. I said, if I'm gonna pay sales tax on this, let me see if I could just drive down there and pick it up. You don't have to ship it. But I called him and they said no, This was in a tear. Detroit location. My eyes. I went ahead and took the hit on the sales tax them. But I get sound here. I got a couple things from them, but recently I've been doing a lot of shopping. That front end audio.
spk_1: 41:36
You ever mess with Westlake Audio?
spk_4: 41:39
I've heard of him, but I
spk_1: 41:40
was never very hill. Now, um, actually, I if I had ah, if I had a card with them, I would have went with them when my guy was there because, like, the quotes would like that much better, All right, because they were, like the new guy in town. So that was gonna send
spk_4: 41:55
it. I mean, you know, I actually kind of question when they came to Nashville, because I just feel like you've got so many companies here already, but I think they're only other location I know of his L A.
spk_1: 42:08
Yeah, that's a good one. I know,
spk_4: 42:10
But front, back to front. In audio, they have, if you get on there mailing list, they have 15% off coupons or coupon codes that they send out pretty much all the holidays and sometimes just a random. A 15% off weekend, 15% off makes a huge difference, huh? And no sales tax. So I'll begin a lot of stuff from front and audio. I want to go back to chaos. What you started saying about eBay. I don't see what you have felt about buying used gear, I guess. Obviously
spk_3: 42:49
it's like it's like I did use gear for a while. Like for real. I only bought used get because because I even how we've said it's really not about the price. I was just like, I just need something that works. So I'm like I would buy old computers. Older computer five have been through, like, five laptops. That is because I always bomb Oh, you know eBay. They're like 4 55 100 for something that already comes with logic, probably already comes with Adobe Suite because you can catch a mad deal on eBay for buying laptops that come with that software instead of buying the laptop, then buying the software. So eBay's clutch for that, even the laptop I have now that I call clutch her name is quick. I got her off eBay, so I feel you because I use. Ah, I have a thing where? I don't mind buying used gear. But if I'm gonna buy use, I need to Just, like, full with first. Yeah, I need to just have a trial run with it first. So a lot of times I buy my use get off Craigslist, because then I can pull up, and it's just like, Okay, I have a moment with you. Give if I actually put some money down because I would hate to spin No money, no money like that. Awesome used gear. You know what I'm saying? They have something go wrong with it or because it's already used, you know? I mean, wants So that's what happened with my golden age. I've got a golden age preempt. And I mean, it was working fine until, like, 23 months and and I just got straight static the same ways are you have kind of probably has static with, um I forgot the name of company that phase, but, um, yeah, yeah, well, antelope. So it's definitely a hit or miss, because you just don't know why I even my rolling I bought that used. And I'm having trouble now with the, um left no the right output of the stereo output. So it's a hit or miss, and that's why this time I was just like I'm doing all new. I'm just, you know, I just have been down that road too many times.
spk_4: 44:45
When you get that deal, when you get that, that can't miss deal. I've walked into Guitar Center and they had They've got this case that Okay, so we know that at one time this is Tarzan and River Gate, and one time used to go on Guitar Center and you could look at all of the nice things for you. I walk in Guitarist in a river Gate, and I see this glass case and there's a tube tech compressor. There's there's something else, but I see this the stereo mic take pre, and this is actually the pre that. I think you in Oh, say are going through right now. The pre was $1500. Brand new. I think Sweet water had discounted it down to like, 1200. I think Guitar Center had a used one sitting over there for 5 99 so I was like huh I walked because first I walked in, I said, Winded guitar center, Get tube tick like out in the open like this. Enough found out that whole case was used Stuff. I grabbed that pre and I told myself, and I know Mike that Mike, take the owner. I'm like, even if something is wrong with this pre Aiken might take us a Nashville company. I can drive over to my tick and hand it to them and have them fix it. But 5 99 for that stereo pre.
spk_3: 46:11
And that's why I use the one that's all you want. And it would be my light on This is our grabbed it. That's I think that's the perfect scenario to buy youse gear when you can be secured. That the company How we just said, Like if the company know the company's gonna fix it, especially if they're local, like, I would definitely take that chance.
spk_4: 46:31
So this brings me back to what you were saying. Okay, so do you reward who helped you with the sale? If the sale is out of phrases, do you reward the person who helped us in your sales engineer? You you quit like you just bought some headphones. You questioning these headphones? This person is giving you the speed back on these headphones. But then you find another company that selling them for cheaper. So do you reward the man that helped you, or did you go with the lower? Do you go with the lower rate?
spk_1: 47:03
Some funny. You said that because I like being education in having to kind of juggle these relationships. Um, I've learned it is not always about the price is about relationships, writes about people. So let's say, for example, I have I said thing my last year, teaching my budget. I probably had, like, 15,000 like to buy stuff. And this is already in the program, fully equipped with a $1,000,000 studio and whatever. And so But I was still giving federal money $15,000 to buy stuff, right? So I know I'm miss my toys. I miss my kids, so but I missed my choice. But anyway, so with some like that, you know, once I get quotes on everything, what I would do I would go through our highlight. I will print out the quote. I will highlight. You know what I would look at both items or look at the item on both papers. Have a highlight. Where was cheaper at all. Right, if it was something like more than, like, $20 I'm going with the cheaper one. If it's something where is, like, less than 20 I'll go with the other person, just so that way I am still buying stuff, which I'm still giving you on money, and I'm still giving them money, too. And so that's why we even look now on a personal level now that I'm building my own business because I'm not dealing in that amount of volume product most like lam going well was less expensive.
spk_4: 48:37
This is me at all. If you helped me with sale Uh huh. I wouldn't mind getting it from even if someone hit. Look, I understand you've got to get your commission and but if I if I know what I want already and
spk_1: 48:52
I, like you already come to him and you saying they
spk_4: 48:53
already know what I want then, yeah, I'm gonna go with any deal. I find, you know that maybe, maybe cheaper. But you have. You helped me with it. Then you know I'm gonna try to help you. Ah, you know, get you get your commission for that,
spk_1: 49:07
You know, without what I may start doing, Or I may even want to look into, depending on how much help is given. Go. We never hear about this much, but like tipping your engineer in their own like your set yourselves engineer in this case. But the only reason why I'm thinking about it is because I've been tipped in the studio twice by an artist by the same artist. And the first time it blew me away. It's
spk_4: 49:34
blowing me away right now thinking about that.
spk_1: 49:37
I mean, for the first time, I'm so first time.
spk_0: 49:41
So what? You just have to cook.
spk_3: 49:43
I know about today. You know, that's the first
spk_1: 49:45
time. So I did particular studio. We settle up at the end of this session, right? So when we did, I'm like, I'm and that'll be You know what? Whatever their total was if we did, I can't remember. But that would be so much so I have a much bone me. Give me the cash boom. You know, I kind of like, Oh, hey, man, you gave him too much. I'm
spk_3: 50:07
not, man. That's
spk_1: 50:07
for you, man. All right. What? Oh, we're off, Earl. Thanks, buddy. Like, Yeah, man, you ain't here doing that. I'm saying you're doing your thing, man. You don't have to Do you know X y z? So I'm like, Cool. So you take me $60. I'm, like, bet Next time. Oh, it gets better next time he comes in and mind you, man, this is super cool. Solid do works like a really, like legal job. Like, ain't no d boy being hustling like he he working hard for the money, man. And, um, next time he came in This is great. Next time we came in, we did a three hour session. The session was 150 gets. How much money you put in my hand? Thom Nulty 300. I'm like breath.
spk_0: 50:54
You promise? Started crying, and
spk_1: 50:56
I didn't start. Come. But I did have to ask because I was so curious. Some, like a man
spk_3: 51:01
asked for next time. Yeah, I like a Is this for something as a woman is my first question. I knew where she was going with you. No, no, no. I got it. What the fuck. You want me to fucking one e looking? Because, like, I can't imagine being in situation, because this is
spk_1: 51:32
it. I mean, I was blown away with some like you, like, grow free. I'm like, I've done so much more for people, you know? I'm saying that, you know, I'm saying barely wanna pay or show up on time or whatever. Yeah, And so when you getting me to finish something like, Yo, thanks, man. I appreciate it, but I just gotta ask. I'm curious. Why are you tipping me $150? You know, and he was like, uh because, man, you're doing your thing, man. And I'm saying give us actually, a few minutes when you get the vocals, right? You're doing this and that. You're like, man customer service, man. You're doing a job, man. You're doing a great job. And I'm like, I
spk_3: 52:13
know he wants some booty e No, I guarantee I
spk_1: 52:18
guarantee you, he doesn't. And I don't think his baby daughter or his girlfriend would appreciate
spk_3: 52:25
it. He probably had to situations where he was recorded with his cousins, in them, in the closet with the crates. And, you know, I'm saying so that's probably the first risk. You don't know what
spk_1: 52:35
I mean. But here's the crazy thing, right, Because you would look and be like, Oh, you do don't know like not they do. Local shows like these ain't just like, you know, I'm saying, like, just like
spk_0: 52:46
I need to make a beat for me,
spk_1: 52:47
Yeah, me. Anyway, I said, I have to say and paying it forward. I wonder I would be willing to tip my sales engineer if they went above and behind. Like, Oh, you got me. Deal, man, you help me figure this out is like a guys this customer service, you know, it's the same as being a waiter is the same as being a rideshare driver
spk_4: 53:11
was talking about going above and beyond. My sails ripped at the time when I bought that Or Ryan, 32. So what was funny about this is that everything that gear fists is on sale for the most part, like 95% of the products that they sail there is on sale. I generally buy stuff that's the two times of the year. I buy a lot of tears gear fests because it's on sale and Christmas time because it's on sale. So it gear fast. I'm telling myself, Okay, though Ryan is 3000. I'm like, it's probably gonna be at least 10% off. I'm okay. Maybe 2700. I need these D B 25 cables. No much those. I'm like 100 100 each. So I'm adding up. Everything'll Okay, now the cables. I need 100 each. So my cell I get there and I asked the the people antelope, I said, What's the Gear fest price? That's that's what you asked for Is Akira Fest price? That's what the sales prices for this weekend. What's the gear fest price for their own? Ryan? He said, Oh, it's not on sale. And I was like, Quit playing What's the What's the Gear fest? Private life? Peru. And he's like, No, it is not on sale, I said, Okay, so I go to my, um I meet my sales engineer in the building and and here we had already kind of previously discussed this, that I was gonna get Theo Ryan and I told him, You know, I'm thinking about getting some nails now. He's like, what happened to doing? Ryan, I say Do said it's not on sale. He goes, may go, Livy, Hold all. I'll relive it. You let me go check these need to be fired. He goes up, he goes up to his death. He comes back down. He said, Yeah, he's right. It's not on sale. I saw. So I'm not. I'm not about to buy nothing that Beerfest that's not on sale when literally everything else under this roof is on sale. So he said, Hold on. He says So let, uh how many cables do you need? So I told him how many cables I needed. He's okay. He said, would you get Theo Ryan if I get you those cables at no cost? Yeah, because those getting me the most
spk_3: 55:12
about 150. It wasn't on sale for you.
spk_4: 55:14
That was the tune percent. That that was the 10% that I expected to save anyway, So he definitely went above and beyond with that. But I want to talk about tipping. I guess you could say this was a tip, but this was pretty crazy. I went in, uh, what does that studio down the street from the underground ocean way I went in ocean Way studio for I think, some event that they hit there and I think a couple nights before and guitar Center I just put my business card upon the little Tak wol. You know, she comes running up to me. She's like, Oh, you know, aren't you Zohar? And I'm like, Yeah, I don't know. You she like, Oh, you know, emailed you and all this. I'm like, No, you didn't. I email close to my phone like, Can I get back to people? And I know she pulls up my website on her phone like, isn't this you? And I'm like, Yeah, that's me. You didn't email me, But you know what's up? So you don't want to talk to you about mixing something I'm like, Okay, cool. So she takes me, She works at the studio. She takes me to a room and she plays me. It's like a like a gospel song. It's okay. Yeah, I can. I can mix that. No problem. She's like, I kind of want it. Have a look. Hip hop feel to it. No problem. None. I got you. And she's telling me how these in these big name mixed engineers becoming through ocean way all the time. But nobody would really take her seriously. So, like, No, I'll do it. So she gave me She gave me a hard drive with the files. She gave me the lyrics to the song. She even gave me a written story that went along with the song and she gave me I should have took this, but she was gonna give me CDs, Stack of CDs. And I was like, I got CDs at home. Don't work But I didn't realize that she wanted each MC Lyte eat. I didn't email her a mix. I put it on CD, dropped it off in the studio, and she check it out the next day. But the tipping part we got down to the money. She asked me, how much would I charge her to do the mix? I told her how much how it's Archer. And she said, Ah, okay. She said, Well, what if I give you double? And I was like,
spk_3: 57:25
Sure, I mean e no, that's you paying me for something. I know it was really going on. It was like, Oh, yeah, sure, she was just like she was like, I just want to come back to you. I
spk_4: 57:42
want you to remember me. And I was like, This will make me remember.
spk_0: 57:47
You just remember that just now.
spk_3: 57:51
Has he been back?
spk_0: 57:54
Bends in the one in this town?
spk_4: 57:58
That was That was odd. But I was Ah, found that found that odd.
spk_3: 58:03
That's what's up, because I mean, yeah, it's so
spk_1: 58:08
messy. Show all you upcoming artists out there. You get what you pay for. You know, I'm saying so. It's okay to tip for exceptional customer service. Like I feel like we've all had average experiences, right? But when you find that person I told somebody died of the day trying in the studio with me at the record shop, we having some scheduling conflicts because it basically trying to coordinate three scheduled my schedule, the artist schedule and availability at the studio. And I was telling them, Hey, I'm not there this time. I mean, you still see if you can get in there. I just won't be there. I'm just not the engineer. Well, we're gonna be in it. I don't know. You gotta call the studio, but I will say engineers are like barbers, man like and yong go switching up your Barbara. Other times some like pro proceed. And I'm saying with your own
spk_3: 59:01
engineers are like barbers. Yeah, I will take this opportunity to interject Introduction Interject. Yeah, that one. Yeah. Um before you evaporate, I'm so lost right now it's a clip has gone viral for no reason She's saying that they had to evacuate a building this big. They told us to evaporate the building anyway, most often it's so last episode we not Was it last episode at some previous episode We talked about, like, bouncing down audio, and we kind of got on like how you don't really want to hear that bounce, you know, offline, bouncing versus online bouncing, Uh, and we kind of joked about it, but I didn't want to mention that it is preferable to bounce online. Of course, you don't want to hear it, just turn it down and walk out the room. But that prevents clipping like if it's doing offline, bouncing because you know what just bounces faster. But online bouncing helps prevent clipping when you're bound to get down to you know, the final or to the mastering engineer. So you want to bounce down online? But I mean, in real time
spk_1: 1:0:21
Now for the for the kind of super motivated, overachieving student out there, There's listening to the the advice you just gave, Where may they go to follow up on that and get more information so they, you know, can understand in full contacts for themselves,
spk_3: 1:0:38
Like the difference between real time in offline back.
spk_1: 1:0:41
It's just like doing a Google search. Oh, is it? Is it like a specific author engineer website that you kind of
spk_3: 1:0:50
oh, lighting with? I would learn that watching a mastering video. Okay, so that's where I learned that it. So if you kind of I don't know what you could type in, but typing in offline, bouncing versus online bouncing, I'm sure we'll bring up some results. Um, but definitely watching some mastering videos is very helpful in mixing. I've been using a lot of mastering techniques in my mixes, and I noticed that by the end of my mix, I have, um, like my levels without adding, like, you know, a limiter just so I can hear a little better. Like my master channel will be blank and my levels will be even like holy shit like the master are You wasn't like v C's on your channels, are you? Ah, like using sense. Yeah, I'm using, you know, um I do like I try to get the signal to where I like it and then use buses and sends toe. Um, you know, do parallel compression or adding reverb in delaying effects and that sort of thing. But using mastering techniques have, I don't know, just allow my mix, even at the end to sound more like a master. That's what one of things I learned the empty issue of one of these, they try to tell you earlier, is like Think about the next year's or the end user, you know, I mean, I always think about the process that's coming behind your process.
spk_4: 1:2:11
You've got me. You think in saying that your master channel is open and empty. You've got me thinking of some of the sessions I see where it's like 12 plug ins on the big box it up like it's like it's not necessary.
spk_1: 1:2:26
So what's one of the master and techniques that you're alluding to right now? I just gives light. Why?
spk_3: 1:2:32
The biggest one I'm using is, um, using multi band compression toe even out a, um to kind of even out of frequency response of, Ah, um, channels. So, like, essentially what a d s or does. I would do that for a base. That's maybe to boo me in a region that the kick is in and I want to bring. And I want the kick to come out more than the base on that frequency instead of cutting it with the E. Q. I'll just compress it so that it's a little quieter or I'll compress that frequency. So whenever the kick hits, I'll use a compressor and narrow the, um, the high and low pass filter so that it's only hitting that frequency in the bass guitar. Um, you know, So when the kick hits just that frequency is going down and that relationship can stay. You may like, uh, side chain compression. Yeah, In that instance, I chain compression or jizz. Compressing the frequency itself on the Channel is so no, because
spk_1: 1:3:36
on a multi band you can dial in my more than one indolent specific frequents, like a multi bank compressor life of those yet I don't know. It's basically like an e Q and A compressor put together like you get the controls of E Q. Where you get, you know, different frequency ranges. And then you can compress those as opposed to a standard compressor that applies it to the whole overall sound.
spk_4: 1:4:04
Yeah, there's I've never done this because usually I'm used aside chain compression. I'm compressing the whole the whole range. But I've got the waves. See, six multi band compressor You didn't know You consigned chain certain you can cite chain different bands and I just never I've never done that before. Both
spk_3: 1:4:25
faces up high caste, ladies and gentlemen, some real engineers in the building throwing that shit.
spk_4: 1:4:32
Multi band compression is, uh, advanced level stuff.
spk_1: 1:4:38
You know what, and I don't use it. I didn't find myself using multi band compression until I started. Like working in a record shop in underground studio a lot more and rappers coming in with these overly compressed beats from from beat stars and air bidding YouTube and I'm getting to be And I'm like, yo, you
spk_4: 1:5:01
got a compress that low end Oh, yeah, I'm like,
spk_1: 1:5:04
yeah, the producer who made this beat was not an engineer. I'm saying so early on. So I started messing with multi bank compression, Just detained that low in. So that way is, you know, cause
spk_4: 1:5:19
well, I'm gonna throw out my multi band compression tip and I need to get back to use this heavy. Used it in a while, but I will put a multiple a compressor on my mix bus. Or I used to put a multi band compressor on my mix bus, but not use it to compress the multi band compressors already split up into different bands. I wouldn't adjust those bands, and I would so low each band so I can hear what's going on in each frequency range. So I would use a multi band compressor MME. Or so to monitor through. Instead of actually compressing. I can hear exactly what's in here. A great example of this is if I'm trying to clear something out of my low end, I can solo just the low end through the multi band compressor. And here just what's in that low end by steel here and some of the vocal in that low end there that I want to clean out. I can heip pass it until I don't hear it in that section, that band anymore. So that's that's one way that I use. Multiple and compression were without compressing, though.
spk_3: 1:6:24
Mountebank pressure is like a new That's the curve because, like you said, I didn't find a use for it, really until recently. You gotta
spk_4: 1:6:30
know what you're doing with you. Don't You could mess really quick with a motive
spk_1: 1:6:35
airing room. You're watching videos or or reading articles by engineers have been doing at 30 40 years, and you keep seeing this word you like, but I haven't been doing that, but I liked it. So then you start like a leaf for me being self conscious, you know, it's time you start doubting like Wait. I thought it was good, but I didn't do it like that. So was he really good? You know, and I honestly for me on the engineering side, because I still look at producing a engineer light. I've had two different journeys with each other, but on the engineering side, like I really just started developing like this. Sweat this swagger type confidence, like within the past part of, like, couple years, like to the point where, like, I will say out loud without hesitation, like I'm dope, man. You know, I'm saying, like I mean, there's still and and in that darkness there still humility, realizing, like, you know, like, when we're chopping it up, I'm learning stuff. I'm like, Oh, I got try that. Oh, I got tried that. But I'm no longer. I'm not like I've grown. Oh, matured from that kind of insecure dude that's sending my mentor my mix like a what you think you know, I'm saying, like, scared to ask and is like, you know, I mean sometime that tried to creep back in because you do want your stuff to be good and you want You know, I'm saying, of course declined to be happy and be respected by your contemporaries and mentors, but something I mean, have you ever had that moment when you finish, it makes you just like I killed, I just
spk_4: 1:8:12
I think about it, Yes, but you see, that's your opinion, though, so you don't know until someone else hears that mix. And I had a moment where when I was in school and I did a mix and one of my classmates was interning at a mastering studio Master phonics down there on music row. And he said, Hey, when you guys I was mixing it at the school on their SSL, So he was like, When you get through mixing this man, let me let me master it and I'll you know, I'll take it down to, ah, master phonics and do it there. And the mastering engineer there will have his, ah, have his ears on it, too. Okay, cool. So I got through with the mix and send it to Ah, and he comes back and he tells me, he says, Ah ha, which I remember the Mastering Engineers name. I think it was Tommy came from his last name, but he said he told him. He said, I thought you said a student did this mix and I was like, Oh, I ee, I think the only thing he told me to I think he told me to pull out some I think some eight k or four k, something like that. But other than that he was that he was explaining away by the mix, and I was like. Okay, that that's a really good feeling. That and when people, This is something this comment not realized lets you know that you did a good job when someone ask if you did it.
spk_3: 1:9:45
Oh, yeah, you didn't. And
spk_4: 1:9:47
and they know you did it. I remember the remember the beating. I'm there. I was making a beat and my dad came in and he said you made this video for two hours and, um, you remember? I guess they had him here in Nashville, too. Well, we probably weren't in Nashville at this time. I know you remember Cats Music cast music was, ah, Music Store in Memphis. They had a couple locations. The first album are produced. I hit before, Like, as I was recording in working on it, I kept going to the manager at the music store and I built a relationship with him and because I kept telling me in Once this album comes out, I want you to sell a couple in the music store, you know, take four or five of them, you know, whatever. So I finally we get the album. Don't I get it pressed up? Take it to him. he puts it in the CD player there in the store, and we're talking in the album's playing. And he goes, You did this. Yeah, man like you So that when someone says that that's how you That's how you know it's good when they ask you and they know it Good night as well. Go ahead and wrap this episode up. Guess on that.
spk_1: 1:11:00
Well, no, I was just going to ask the question, because I feel like in a roll right now. We have producers, engineers, so I'm just wondering, like when the producer had his own, like J. J. Baker and cadence like, kind of
spk_4: 1:11:12
had that moment?
spk_1: 1:11:14
Well, well, either we're not really that question, but kind of what has your relationship and communication been like with mixed engineers in terms of setting your expectations and kind of just navigating that whole thing? If that makes sense? Ah, work. Well, what's for me? With right? So, like, for example, you say, like, you know, we were just kind of geeked out for like, 15 minutes talking about, You know, I'm saying super technical stuff from a producer's standpoint, where lifetimes is more focused on just e aesthetic, the art, like when you're handing that off like knowing knowing your cousin is super technical right in your own. And you're in super artists moat. How do you communicate to him? Your expectations in a way where his technical brain
spk_0: 1:12:03
I just tell him what's important to me and trusting the do risk mocha,
spk_4: 1:12:06
I think, is engineers this up about that first episode maybe second of its own. We talked about communication. It's for us to interpret that you do. Yeah,
spk_0: 1:12:15
but I mean this I don't like putting people in the box. I pretty much communicate was important to me like I might be like. I make sure the drums here, you know, and make sure it's clean, like, for the most part, like, uh, I'm more of Ah, the song is the most important. I mean, a B is cool, but his legacy it is a good representation of me. I'm good. No reason for me to need peak or somebody's mixing. And I it makes me heroes like if I'm there mixing me with you. Okay? Yeah, we could sit there and be critical, but if I'm passing over my o b to you to mix. I'm not going to sit there and stand on your shoulder about high woman. Beat the sale. Gosh, you're saying when I when I've done my part, You know, if I'm a producer, let the engineer do his part. I always feel like the whole key to making a good song. Is everybody just being the started
spk_1: 1:13:13
every roll? It is that similar to kind of your perspective
spk_3: 1:13:19
Does I want the Ah, well, it was another reason to use the mix. Engineers just have a fresh perspective and much here. So So by the time you get it to the to the mix engineer, just like I need your perspective, I need you to bring something new to this because I may be dead on it because I created it.
spk_0: 1:13:34
Yeah. Bring stuff out. I didn't hear right, but they can't do that. If you tell them right. Giving him 20 things. You want them to doing the beans. Like what you didn't do. Have I
spk_1: 1:13:46
experience like that?
spk_3: 1:13:47
Now, if I hear the mix and it's not what I thought it was gonna be, then I have Maur direction, a communication, but I give them the opportunity to be like, do your thing. Just
spk_4: 1:13:58
it is a mixed injured ear. There's two type of people you've got the people. That's good. Let me do what I do. And you've got the people who's going to tell me what they want me to do. And I try to tell some other makes engineers I know like they off. They want me to Addison this Okay, if they're paying you for that Yeah,
spk_0: 1:14:20
that's that's what I was gonna say. Those people that just want you to do everything they better be paying you. Yeah, you If you're not, if if you're not paying him like, I feel like you don't have the option to be supercritical. I mean, I know that my rub a lot of people the wrong way, years, no art. But it's the truth, though, because this time is money, and they're spending their precious time on your song. And if you're not paying them and then you accidentally do multiple things over and over over again is inconsiderate of who they are, what they got it going on. What their life situation is just is disrespectful.
spk_3: 1:15:03
And I've dealt with somebody like that And it was the worst experience
spk_4: 1:15:06
of you. Because you you know, if you you have as a mix injured here, you have to learn to detach yourself from. So this isn't your song, right? Oh, they want They want the drums super loud. Okay. Make the drum super loud. That might not be This is my song where I would want it in the big city If that's what you want me to do That's what I'm gonna do is not my song I'm gonna do what you want me to do now those other people who tell me Hey, do what you do I've been in the studio with people. Now be thinking something. I see you're thinking something. Do it. You know, we can always undo it. Do do it and whatever you think and do it. Okay. Club. I think I hit, like, a vocal effect or something. I'm hearing them okay. Not dialed up the delay or whatever I was doing. I like that. Cool or, you know, if you don't like it No, you're not gonna
spk_1: 1:15:53
hurt my feelings. Man is this
spk_4: 1:15:54
is your song. You're not gonna hurt my feelings. If I If I essentially makes him feel like not put this super cool effect on the vocal. And you come back like, not that it You're not gonna hurt my feelings. So yes. No, it is not. It's not your zone, but we gotta you mix. Engineers have to have to realize that if you know you're getting paid, Thio mix this and do what they they want you to do. Do it.
spk_1: 1:16:20
That's a good word.
spk_4: 1:16:22
I was gonna wrap up this episode. I want to remind everyone you can email us favours up podcast at yahoo dot com. If you have any questions, any questions, comments, anything you want answered on the podcast, was excited to get our first question here. Yeah, since and the questions on and also review us comment on Apple podcasts Love to get everybody's feedback. And I'm Czar
spk_3: 1:16:50
unpack. A young chaos was good talking
spk_2: 1:16:53
to you.
spk_1: 1:16:54
Yeah. O'Shea, can we, uh, talk to you again?
spk_2: 1:16:58
I'm Jay Bakker. Thanks for having me. And we're out